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Dudley Square officially gets renamed Nubian Square
By adamg on Thu, 12/19/2019 - 11:00am
The Herald reports the Public Improvement Commission voted this morning to rename Dudley Square in Roxbury as Nubian Square. Although city voters as a whole rejected the idea in a non-binding referendum last month, people in the precincts in and near the square supported the idea - and, at today's meeting, so did the mayor's office.
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Comments
The vote didn't turn out how they thought it would
...Fixed that.
Anyone caught using the term Dudley Square from now on will pay a nickel into the swear jar.
Back to work.
The Mayor had said ahead of
The Mayor had said ahead of the vote that he would always make the decision based on how the neighborhoods around Dudley Square voted, NOT based on the citywide totals.
So much for "one person, one
So much for "one person, one vote."
Yes, SO much for one person,
Yes, SO much for one person, one vote in the wards/precincts that ACTUALLY live and deal with Dudley/Nubian Square. I'll happily respect the wishes of the residents on this one.
I’m one of those residents.
I’m one of those residents.
If you want something to go to a citywide vote, you don’t get to just ignore the results. Will of the people, and all that.
On a non-binding ballot question?
You can do whatever the hell you want to do with the results of a non-binding ballot question. Somebody gathered enough signatures to get it on the ballot, but that doesn't mean the results of the vote are enshrined in bronze. The affected neighborhood voted for the change; the city isn't obligated to listen to input from voters in Brighton.
The only reason the referendum was citywide ...
Was because the state made the city do that. Also, it was non-binding.
Yep
Well, good luck wherever you move to!
By the same logic...
An inversion of that logic: if I remember correctly, the areas of the state that actually had rent control voted to keep rent control, but it was repealed because the state as a whole rejected it. So which is it, rule by the locally affected community, or rule by the broader community? I guess it depends on which side of a particular issue you're on... in other words, all these "local/broader" referendum arguments are politics/bullshit as usual.
Uh, no
They asked for people's opinions, turns out the people who lived in that area supported it, so they did it. No fixing necessary.
binary choice
The regular citizens were not given much choice over the name. It was Nubian or Dudley and it doesn't feel like a choice at all. There were better names....much better names than the slave-holding Nubian culture of past.
If they didn't want Nubian...
they would have voted no, right?
I suspect most people voted for Nubian
just because they wanted to get rid of Dudley. And if you have a citywide vote on the issue, then you should respect the will of the majority of the voters - even if it is "non binding".
Some form of Ferdinand would
Some form of Ferdinand would be just ducky , as I think part of the building still stands there. Even the BPDA (http://www.bostonplans.org/about-us/building-boston-case-studies/dudley-... ) touted its horn in recognition of the company's contribution to the viability of its operation,providing goods and jobs at the time.
"regular citizens"?
Who are these "regular citizens", and who's NOT a "regular citizen"?
good lord, if you don't have
good lord, if you don't have an adequate grasp of history and how intraafrican slavery worked and how it's not remotely comparable to how white colonizers established their brand of slavery, please just stay out of the conversation. the disingenuousness is astounding.
Re-naming
Dover Street in the South End was re-named East Berkeley Street in 1967 because it had a bad reputation.
But the MBTA never re-named Dover Station on the old Orange Line that ran above Washington Street until it was dmolished in 1987.
Will the MBTA change Dudley to Nubian on its transit maps, bus stop signs and bus roll signs?
I still call the Tobin Bridge the Mystic River Bridge but I'm ok with Gilmore instead of Prison Point..
As noted below, the station
As noted below, the station is actually named for Dudley Street, not Dudley Square
Will the MBTA change Dudley to Nubian?
They did change Yawkey Station to Lansdowne.
That would be a lot more work
Yawkey -> Lansdowne is one commuter rail station on one line, with no bus service ending there.
Dudley is on every painted and printed system map throughout the entire MBTA, because it is the end of the Silver Line. It's also on every southbound bus stop sign along the Silver Line, #1, and #66 buses.
I miss hearing the automated
I miss hearing the automated voice on the commuter rail announce “yucky!”
And the percentage of people
And the percentage of people who live in that area who voted was?
well
im glad we got to vote for that?
Great -- Nubian -- Celebrating a Civilization Built on Slavery
Whatever you can say about the various incarnations of Nubia -- there is one constant until ????? the Nubians were a Slave-centric Society -- just like Rome
Oh-Well at least we can now feel good about the renaming
Exactly
I fully support renaming of Dudley Square. However I think Nubian Square is a mistake. It was, as pointed out, a slavery based society. The cynic in me cant help but note that the name awareness came from the prominent business for many years in Dudley Square,Nubian Notion.
There have been many African American Bostonian names who might be better choices. Horatio Homer, Micheal Haynes, and William Monroe Trotter to name a few.
Rolls Eyes
More white history of black people - up next, Mein Kampf was really written in Africa!
Ah Yes
The white guy who doesn't live there is lecturing the people who do live there.
LOL
The name is actually meant to
The name is actually meant to honor a community center that was based in the square for some 50 years, as you would know if you read a single article on the subject to completion.
Retail Establishment
A Nubian Notion was a retail establishment. Whatever it's entrenchment in the area, I don't know that it can be termed a "community center".
The old Orange Line station
The old Orange Line station was Dudley Street station, and the bus terminal on its site uses the same name. Since Dudley Street still exisits, does the station remain Dudley?
Janey is the worst
Does this mean that in Lower Roxbury we'll get Nubian Square parking stickers? Because I'm sure we all voted to approve that.
Don't be fooled for a second. Councilor Janey and the rest of them do not care about "surrounding neighborhoods." Which was proven when she underhandedly changed our parking status out of the neighborhood where our services are.
No, because it doesn't work that way
Boston parking permits are designated by overall neighborhood - so they'd keep their new Roxbury stickers.
What is an overall
What is an overall neighborhood?
Why is the tiny Leather District a zone, as well as all of Allston-Brighton from BU to BC?
The backstory on this is that
The backstory on this is that Councilor Janey singlehandedly had the resident parking permit signs between Mass Ave and Melnea Cass Boulevard changed from South End to Roxbury with ZERO public process, and she had the ones on Washington St in that area removed entirely. She claims that that area has always been considered Roxbury, despite that fact that when you look at historical maps, it was always part of the South End.
Why does this matter?
If you live there, you get that sticker.
You are complaining about your *right* to park well away from your house - like free parking for work.
Dukakis Station
Nobody will call Dudley "Nubian" any more than anyone calls South Station "Michael Dukakis Station". And I like Dukakis, by the way. I can't say the same for the slave owning Nubian culture, though.
yup
I support a name change, not Nubian tho. I would have rather seem it be a Boston person of color instead. Many of our squares are named after locals, why did we have to pick this name for Dudley.
I would have preferred Elma Lewis Square
Nothing in the city is currently named after her, to my knowledge, and she's far more deserving than Nubia is of this honor.
Franklin Park
There is the Elma Lewis Play house in the Park: https://www.franklinparkcoalition.org/featured-events/elma-lewis-playhou...
[edit: corrected spelling, thanks!]
True, but ...
it's not an actual permanent structure, just a designated outdoor location for a few summer concerts each year. And it's tucked away in a place that most people don't even know exists. Dudley Square (or perhaps its soon-to-reopen library branch) could give her the prominence she deserves.
(Also, it's Elma, not Emma)
people
who think the bad way about race have a bunch of floating signifiers involved in their precarious and paranoid self-esteem. white people are leading in this, and it is no surprise to see the spiritual hoi polloi of other races fall victim to same. the truth-obfuscating benighted liar/ conman seems to be the collective conscience of very group. we are so fucked.
Dudley station
The bus terminal should be renamed after Rosa Parks and a statue erected in her honor.
A Public Improvement
The Herald reporter misreported. It was actually the City's Public Improvement Commission who has the authority (and approved) the change. https://www.boston.gov/public-notices/7358026
Switched the link
To the full Herald story, which has it right, thanks.
Adam, does the city have that
Adam, does the city have that voting data available? I also live in Roxbury, near Dudley, so I'd be extremely curious to see how people in my area voted for this.
No doubt they do
I'll check to see if they've posted precinct data on it. In the meantime, there's this map.
info here:
info here:
https://www.boston.gov/sites/default/files/embed/u/unofficial_ward_and_p...
More-specific map
Here's a map with results by ward/precinct, so more granular than that other map.
https://public.tableau.com/profile/john.keith#!/vizhome/BostonQ1_2019/Sh...
As a resident
I think changing the name is good, but this name in particular is pretty cringe
i wonder if this is to
i wonder if this is to impress the n.a.a.c.p. next year.
Fascinating
I had no idea that so many Americans were scholars of the history of slavery on the African continent.
Do they realize there's still Nubian people around today?
I suspect these commenters would not be super into someone saying
even though it's just as valid.
You think?
https://www.theroot.com/white-tears-attempt-to-drown-out-the-true-histor...
I'm still waiting for "the
I'm still waiting for "the Irish were slaves too" comment
The Irish?
Why would you comment on the plight of the Irish who arrived in Boston in boats called coffin ships and were greeted with No Irish Need Apply signs. I support the efforts of the residents of Nubian square in Roxbury and the residents of Fields Corner who wish to rename their neighborhood to Little Saigon. I also support getting rid of the seal of the commonwealth that depict a peaceful indian being threatened with a white arm holding a sword over his head.
Likewise, I had no idea that
Likewise, I had no idea that so many Bostonians were scholars whose lives are meaningfully impacted by a location name of 'Dudley'.
i feel strongly
that there is significant overlap between the "but Nubians had slaves!" group and the "confederate monuments are about preserving history and Southern Culture" group.
Magoo sez.
This has been foretold by our ancient star bearers. Upon the return of Planet X along the southern equatorial transect which skirts Jupiter, the Nubian fleet shall draw nigh from the dark side of the moon and claim the genesis of our kind. So let it be said that the coming of Tan is nigh. Magoo.
They can call the area Jehoshaphat Square for all I care
but what exactly does Nubia have to do with that area?
A Nubian Notion
It's basically being based on the fact that for a long time there was an anchor store to the area called A Nubian Notion. I remember it well, they even sold concert tickets there in the 70s (it started out as a head shop type of place), but I don't know if it's worth renaming the whole area for.
The store had a second location inside Ruggles Station
but sadly, that also closed.
I wrote in "Ugi's Square."
I wrote in "Ugi's Square."
Long time location of the now
Long time location of the now defunct Nubian Notions store
holy shit
magoo is starting to make sense