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Several Brighton intersections to get automated pedestrian-crossing signals for Jewish sabbath
By adamg on Wed, 10/02/2024 - 10:23am
City Councilor Liz Breadon (Allston/Brighton) reports that BTD has ajusted traffic lights at several Brighton intersections to automatically signal time for pedestrians to cross between 7 p.m. on Friday and 7 p.m. on Saturday - so that observant Jewish pedestrians don't have to press buttons at the intersections on their sabbath.
The new automated pedestrian-crossing lights start this Friday at:
- Faneuil Street and Market Street
- Lake Street and Washington Street
- Foster Street and Washington Street
- Lake Street and Washington Street
- Chestnut Hill Ave, Market Street and Washington Street
- Winship Street, Cambridge Street and Washington Street
- Colborne Road and Comm Ave
- Embassy Road and Chestnut Hill Ave
- Wallingford Road and Comm Ave
- Chiswick Road and Comm Ave
- Beacon Street and Chestnut Hill Ave (Cleveland Circle)
Neighborhoods:
Free tagging:
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Comments
May need seasonal adjustments
since Shabbat runs from sunset Friday to sunset Saturday, and those times change as the seasons do (and also because of the clock changes in November and March).
I used to carpool with a
I used to carpool with a sabbath observant jew, and I did enjoy the early winter fridays
Are traffic signals going to
Are traffic signals going to adjusted for all denominations?
Sure
As soon as you find other denominations that have rules against work, however they define it, on their sabbaths, be sure and let the city know.
Seventh-day Adventists
Seventh-day Adventists
This denomination believes that working on the Sabbath, from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday, goes against one of God's commandments. They believe that violating the Sabbath can harm their spiritual relationship with God.
Latter-day Saints
This denomination believes that the Sabbath is a day for righteous activities and that people should not do any labor that would prevent them from focusing on spiritual matters. They believe that Sabbath activities include worship, prayer, meditation, studying scripture, and visiting the sick.
Other seventh-day denominations
These include Seventh Day Baptists, Davidian Seventh-day Adventists, and Church of God (Seventh Day) conferences.
Sabbatarian Pentecostalists
This includes the Soldiers of the Cross Church.
OK, then the next step ...
Is for them to contact Liz Breadon to arrange a meeting to show which specific intersections in Brighton (and Allston, since that's also part of her district) are heavily used by Seventh-Day Adventists and Mormons, etc. and to see about getting their pedestrian signals automated on their sabbaths.
Because I'm sure you're raising this as a very serious issue and already know that there are, in fact, parts of Brighton (amazingly, the parts with the intersections at issue in the BTD work) that have large communities of observant Jews and that Breadon didn't just come up with this idea out of thin air, but rather spent considerable time with both representatives of those communities and BTD.
And of course, you will come prepared with whatever scriptures or other writings the leaders of those denominations feel prove that pressing a pedestrian-crossing button is considered "work."
There's plenty of writing about interaction with electricity-related items is generally considered prohibited under some interpretations of Judaism; do such things exits for Seventh-Day Adventism or Mormonism?
Easy
It's the same day. Solving the problem for the Jews solves it for the Adventists too.
who else needs this?
Are there people other than observant Jews who have similar rules about working on specific days, and define pressing a button for electrical devices like elevators and pedestrian crossings as work? If so, they should absolutely ask for and receive the same accommodation, but not expect BTD to guess what they need, where, and on what days.
Note that this change is for specific intersections, not for every pedestrian crossing in the city. Occasionally getting a red light when there are no pedestrians or cars won't be a significant inconvenience to you, or anyone else driving in the neighborhood on the sabbath.
Most are already on a timer
Most are already on a timer
https://www.bostonmagazine.com/news/2017/07/25/crosswalk-buttons/
Hi, I'm from the Church of Recall
Our beliefs forbid us from pushing a button to get a walk signal unless car drivers have to stop and roll down their window and push a button to get a green. We celebrate this practice every week, for seven days.
Please set all lights in the city to recall so that we may freely exercise our religion.
Now that’s a religion I could follow.
Were I not already a Jay Walking Civil Disobediencer.
Are you sure??
That would be a Total Recall!
We're doing a Total Recall?
No wonder this story feels like a virtual reality...
All ped lights in the city at
All ped lights in the city at major intersections should be automated. There shouldn't be a need for any beg buttons there. Can have the buttons on less trafficked streets.
No.
This leads to more pedestrian and driver frustration which leads to more risk taking.
Unless
Unless the button is broken and the ped just never gets the light. This is very common.
I can recall it only happening once..
… in all my decades in Boston. I imaging it’s really bad luck to come to a crossing where the button is broken on both sides of the street.
Some lights are set to be automatic or by request depending on the time of day.
This used to be more common
Now 311 takes care of most of them, so long as the Division of Cars and Roads isn't involved.
Also an issue: lights that don't trigger for cyclists and the beg button is needed to get through the intersection.
Funny how automated walk
Funny how automated walk signals seem to work just fine in dozens of other large cities (if not hundreds). Maybe if the signals were automated, drivers might eventually acclimate to the notion that pedestrians have the right to cross the street.
The signals need to be calibrated for pedestrians so they …
…. never have to stop for long. Which will not happen in MA. It works mostly in Manhattan because they have done that.
Even so Manhattan wait times are annoying.
It’s better for the disabled so they don’t have to take extra steps or have issues reaching or pushing a button.
Lights can be set to be automatic at certain times like rush hours when foot and motor traffic are constant and on request at others. That is the best way. Some intersections in Boston have that.
In general many people using all modes of transportation just ignore the lights anyway so why have them?
automated signals
means the cross walk pedestrian light occurs whether there is a pedestrian is there or not. Having an unnecessary signal will negatively impact traffic on the cross streets for no reason. It's on a timer, not a proximity sensor, which is why they're only being programmed for the Sabbath near orthodox communities and synagogues instead of everywhere all the time. Having all signals on timers everywhere will make traffic worse. The only place where there is autosensing is at left turn lanes, which have magnets at the stop line - will only turn the left turn green if a bike or a vehicle is sensed. No left turn need, no left turn, allowing for the traffic going straight to have longer/more frequent greens. There is a science behind all this and they're designed by people who know what they're talking about.
concurrent vs exclusive signals
oh because we should set up traffic signals to minimize driver frustration. /s
Traffic signal beef
Often, the pedestrians get a walk signal at the same time that the driver has the green light, allowing to turn right as the pedestrians are lawfully crossing.
When the pedestrian has a walk signal, the other lights should be either red or red and yellow.
yes
should be flashing yellow or flashing red.
Concurrent lights at intersections...
They're pretty much the standard in much of the world. In many European cities, walk lights are usually concurrent with the green light. This practice conditions drivers to always expect pedestrians on turns. Last time I was in Europe, in Berlin and Munich in 2022, I saw a few exclusive phase lights, but the vast majority were concurrent. Also, beg button activated lights at intersections were few and far between, I saw maybe three the whole time. Beg buttons are the standard at mid-block crossings however.
Exactly. Concurrent,
Exactly. Concurrent, automated walk lights are the standard in virtually every city I've ever visited, with the exception of Boston, and, IIRC, London. Somehow, all those other cities manage to handle the combination of pedestrian and motor vehicle traffic without a bloodbath.
String is cheaper. Just put
String is cheaper. Just put an eruv around it. Problem solved.
But you still cannot do work within a eruv.
Am I wrong? Otherwise you wouldn't need Sabbath Mode on your appliances, for example.
An eruv is a boundary within which you can carry things
not a place where you can "work" on Shabbat.
I thought it was for just this kind of thing,
like lighting stoves and pushing buttons on electronic things?
Melakhot - Activities
Melakhot - Activities prohibited on Shabbat.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/39_Melakhot
One of these activities is Hotza'ah. The Torah prohibition that refers to the act of moving an object between a private and public domain, or transporting an object through a public domain. This includes picking up an object, transporting it, and putting it down. You can "connect" private domains by "extending" the private domain via an eruv because it is an enclosure that symbolically integrates private properties and spaces such as streets and sidewalks into one larger "private domain" by surrounding it with mechitzas (a boundary wall or fence), thereby avoiding restrictions of transferring between domains. It allows folks to carry house keys, tissues, medication and to use strollers and canes. You can check to see if the eruv is up or not.
https://www.bostoneruv.org/bound.htm
http://www.nceruv.org/
https://bethisraelmalden.org/eruv/
https://www.sharoneruv.org/
https://www.bnaitorahma.org/eruv--mikvah.html
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1axrHBnPuLBQKrVk_p7uwVmkzYps&ll...
Mav'ir is the one related to electricity on Shabbat. The Torah prohibition that refers to to igniting, fueling or spreading a fire/flame. Various rabbinical authorities have pronounced on what is permitted and what is not, so it is not uniformly recognized.
Look at that
You learned something today. Congratulations.
Thanks! I did! Also, fuck you sock puppet whoever you are.
.
minor editing issue
Lake Street and Washington Street is listed twice (#2 and #4); should one of them be something else?
Ok
Don't quite understand this need but here we are. If something as trivial as pushing a button is considered work how do they get through all of the other tasks it takes just to get the the area where they would need to punch the button? I can think of many but maybe someone from the faith can help explain this.
They do something similar for
They do something similar for elevators, which can be set to stop on every floor on Shabbat instead of having to hit the button. Walking and out of an automated elevator is not considered work, but hitting the button is.
It's all organized insanity
It's also sophistry wrapped up in agreed-upon group psychosis that we conveniently call "religion".
Even within the religion they can't keep up with technology and deciding if closing and opening a circuit is "building" and "destroying" (two of the esoteric things you can't do on sabbath). The idea that you can still take advantage of things you setup ahead of time to do the same thing you would have done in the instance is such a cop out that if God actually cared about any of this he'd smote them dead for having made such a stupid statement as if they could avoid his wrath through well-timed actions as loopholes (seriously, there's a light bulb that you leave on before sabbath and then "open and close" with a lever if you want light...because that's not burning/creating/whatever so it's allowed).
They've talked themselves down this tiny rabbit hole and realized that in a modern society it's anachronistic to talk about "burning" and "extinguishing" with regards to lightbulbs when modern LEDs don't heat a filament to work like incandescent bulbs did (which meant you couldn't use them because we all agreed to not use them on sabbath when someone said "hey, what about this new technology?").
Do I care that they want to change all the light timings for 24 hours a week? No, but going out of our way as a society to placate some group or other with their religious fervor instead of making the religion decide "ok, maybe requesting a pedestrian signal isn't whatever-excuse-theyve-made-for-calling-it-a-violation" just leads to the opportunity for the next accomodation and the next (for them or anyone else).
Why do we acclimate to them on this and they don't acclimate to us (or find another way to stay to their rules that doesn't involve the rest of us)?
Because the legitimacy of a
Because the legitimacy of a cultural practice is independent of your understanding of it, and we have generally agreed as a society that it is acceptable to make reasonable accommodations for a significant segment of the population provided it does not harm or significantly impact others.
For the record, I am Jewish and I think the Shabbat rules are silly and anachronistic, but things like this don't bother me enough to write an essay complaining about it.
That's baloney
Oh, really? That's an extremely broad claim. In the 70's, Bob Jones University prohibited interracial dating and marriage at its school due to cultural practice. The IRS removed its tax-exempt status. It went to SCOTUS in the early 80s and they agreed with the IRS that prohibiting racial discrimination was more in our interest than religious liberty.
The government doesn't always have to go out of its way to enable your religious activity and pedestrian signals are hardly the same as racial discrimination, but someone else's "cultural practice" ends when it overlaps with the government's interest in all of our liberties. Far more other road users are going to be restricted for more of the day than those who now get to walk safely (or without needing to use a different crossing) without pushing buttons.
It's why the Orthodox will choose to live near a synagogue
They can walk to the synagogue on the Sabbath since riding in a car or other vehicle is prohibited.
There are a bunch of workarounds (i.e. ovens that will keep food warm because cooking is prohibited) that seem nonsensical to outsiders but let people practice what they want to believe as long as they don't harm others.
Such A Beautiful Double Standard
Last week people all over this board were harping on BC for their opposition to a new liquor license abutting the BC line trolley terminal. You know those silly religious people and their silly ways.
One thing which was upvoted 42 times - "The church and Boston College should stfu considering they pay no property taxes and this store will pay taxes. NIMBY freeloading brats."
This week - Isn't is great we accommodate these people and their religious ways with public property.
Two faced as Janus.
These are not the same?
One is setting something that physically exists already to have a certain setting to allow for a proper religious observance by members of the public. Which does not adversely harm those who do not belong to that religious group.
The other is about allowing influence of a specific organization on public policy related to private businesses.
I do not see these as similar situations.
Not the same at all
In addition to all that, BC didn't claim that their objection to the yuppie liquor store was due to Catholic doctrine in any way. Their purported objections were about their students and underaged drinking.
I suspect their actual motivations were either that they have their eyes on that strip for development or just doing a solid for their noted alumnus Bill Galvin.
Absolutely nothing to do with religion.
To be fair (sort of) to BC
They also oppose turning the old Cleveland Circle Dunkin' Donuts into a dispensary.
As somebody who sat through the actual hearing at which BC raised objections to the yuppie convenience store, I can safely say that neither they nor proponents raised any issues involving the Catholic faith - except for the way the store agreed to a later opening time on Sunday so as not to appear too tempting to seven-year-olds going to a family mass at the church across the street, which nobody had any problems with.
The hearing revolved around whether underage college students in general, of whom BC acknowledged they have a few, can control themselves or, failing that, whether their school can, or failing that, whether the store can. Catholicism was just not an issue (again, save for the agreeing to open later on Sunday); nobody was accusing BC of being particularly prone to sloshed sophomores because it's a Catholic institution.
Comparing all this to a harmless attempt to assist constituents who practice a particular religion by automating pedestrian crossing signals and trying to accuse everybody who commented on BC's perpetually thirsty young'uns of hating Catholics is, at a minimum, pretty stupid.
As predictable as the rising sun
Costello harping on our society's rampant persecution of Catholics.
We really ought to create a UHub commenter bingo board.
Bingo?
There would be a picture of a turd in the center and I could stamp it every time you comment.
Did the accuracy of
my comment hurt your little feelings?
Speaking of upvotes and bingo
He must be very upset about this, 73 upvotes!
https://www.universalhub.com/comment/987410#comment-987410
Careful throwing those rocks John
Glass houses and all that.
That post about the BC liquor store seems a little tame for the most part, I think "people all over this board" is doing a lot of work here. But I do see a double standard on your part, seems like you're ok with disparaging certain groups of people when it fits your narrow minded point of view.
https://x.com/streamside1070/status/1840854742408348062
Again, you can always start your own website and police the speech you don't like. Get at it!
Nazis?
You mean it isn't ok to pick on Nazis in your worldview?
Perhaps you should talk with the people who these lights are being set for on Fridays. They might be able to teach you a thing or two about Nazis and what they can do.
Lets break this down John
It does seem like your disparaging current Germans for the sins of their relatives. Now, if someone were to ask you how many pubs your relatives were complicit in bombing, I feel like we'd see steam coming over the horizon from your suburb.
I know plenty of the history of what the Nazi's did to my wife's relatives, weak deflection even for you.
Actually...
Some of them were killed by Germans.
Some bombed Germans.
You are a sad stalker. Seek help.
For a few months, I worked on a project with Mike Godwin
So I'm invoking a particularly slanted version of his law: No more in this subthread about Nazis. Seriously, knock it off.
You want to talk about offensive? Bringing up Nazis in a thread about something that makes the lives of observant Jews slightly easier and HARMS ABSOLUTELY NOBODY ELSE is offensive.
Native Americans
Would like a word ...
As the author of that comment
As the author of that comment with dozens of likes I’d like to point out I think buildings of all religions should pay taxes and not tell others what to do with their property.
Are we pretending drivers respect crosswalk or walk signals?
It is to laugh.
No
This increases frustration for pedestrians and drivers, which encourages more risky behavior.
Hm
You can argue likewise that school crossing guards "increase frustration for pedestrians and drivers", and yet we still have them, and consider them helpful, even necessary. And yeah, I get it, I don't like poorly timed lights either. I don't like having to wait for a couple of minutes when there's no traffic and no one's even trying to make a left turn so why bother with the delayed green. But I don't blow through the light just because I'm frustrated.