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Four Northeastern grad students diagnosed with chickenpox

By adamg on Fri, 10/04/2024 - 8:22pm

The Huntington News reports the four grad students, all of whom live off campus, were recently diagnosed and are now isolating.

Northeastern requires inoculation against the communicable disease or proof of previous infection for all students, but just in case, campus health services will be offering shots next week.

Neighborhoods: 
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Free tagging: 
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chickenpox
Northeastern University
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Comments

By Vicki on Fri, 10/04/2024 - 9:40pm.

According to the CDC, chickenpox is most likely to be serious in "babies, adolescents, adults, and people with weakened immune systems"--which adds up to most of the population.

If you've never had chicken pox and haven't been vaccinated, either get the vaccine or ask your doctor to check your titers.

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By deselby on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 6:29am.

along with Rubella aka German measles. I doubt they got vaccinated for that either.

This anti-vax shit started in Marin County, home of every New Age AWFL movement.

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By Bob Leponge on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 9:00am.

My now retired doc told me that as recently as when she was starting out as a young resident with a fresh MD, chicken pox in adults had an astounding 25% mortality rate. Not a disease to mess around with.

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By SwirlyGrrl on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 9:12am.

If someone with immune compromise gets chicken pox it can be fatal - but the case fatality rate for adults contracting chickenpox has been steady at around 9-10 deaths per 100,000 cases for 40 years - at least in the UK. Adults do account for nearly half of the mortality from chickenpox overall: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1123733/

I doubt that the US has an such an extremely higher fatality rate as to have 25,000 deaths per 100,000 cases instead of 10.

Diseases like mumps and chickenpox are hella worse in adults and can cause lifelong complications. They are not to be messed with, and adults should be vaccinated for them.

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By MC Slim JB on Fri, 10/04/2024 - 9:51pm.

going backwards as a society on something as proven again and again over a couple of centuries now as vaccines.

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By Lee on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 8:05am.

But yeah, this adds proof to the argument that ours is.

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By Sator on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 8:34am.

works in mysterious ways

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By SwirlyGrrl on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 8:50am.

One of my kids had chickenpox before the vaccine was available. The other was vaccinated.

We were told that chickenpox vaccine immunity was life long and wouldn't need a booster. But there were no people in the the late 1990s who had been vaccinated long enough to fully know that. It was a concern at the time of the mandate.

The New England Journal of Medicine published on this in 2007: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa064040

Waning immunity was also found in Korea, which requires vaccination: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8438188/

People my age were expected to get lifelong immunity from our early childhood measles shots, but that didn't turn out to be true. 20 years in, booster shots became the rule due to breakthrough cases in vaccinated individuals.

One of my younger son's friends, whose parents were absolutely pro-vax, who had to have recorded vaccinations to enter kindergarten, has had a mild case of chickenpox as a young adult.

So I wouldn't be so sure that these older (graduate) students were not vaccinated, They would have been some of the earliest to get those vaccines.

Don't get me started on how PFAS messes with vaccinations.

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By Sator on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 9:24am.

I want to hear about how PFAS interacts with vaccinations.

This should be good, I'll make popcorn.

Desperately waiting for the evidence of your claim, and since you're here in good faith, you will provide evidence of your claim....

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By SwirlyGrrl on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 12:10pm.

No need for desperation - let's go!

[adjusts doctoral level epidemiologist with >25 years in the field hat]

Prenatal exposure blunts vaccine immune response:

There was an inverse association between the level of anti-rubella antibodies in the children’s serum at age 3 years and the concentrations of the four PFAS. Furthermore, there was a positive association between the maternal concentrations of PFOA and PFNA and the number of episodes of common cold for the children, and between PFOA and PFHxS and the number of episodes of gastroenteritis.

Full text link: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.3109/1547691X.2012.755580

PFAS blunts adult flu vaccine immune response:

Our findings indicated that elevated PFOA serum concentrations are associated with reduced antibody titer rise, particularly to A/H3N2 influenza virus, and an increased risk of not attaining the antibody threshold considered to offer long-term protection.

Full text link: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4724206/

PFAS reduces response to TDaP boosters in adults (small study size, but well measured exposure and outcome):

Serum PFAS concentrations showed significant negative associations with the rate of increase in the antibody responses. Interestingly, this effect was particularly strong for the longer-chain PFASs. All significant associations remained significant after adjustment for sex and age.

Full text link: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.3109/1547691X.2015.1067259

Considerably larger study size with well measured exposure and outcomes over time in children - Grandjean is one of the earliest and best in the field:

Pre-natal exposure showed inverse associations with the antibody concentrations five years later, with decreases by up to about 20% for each two-fold higher exposure [...] Joint analyses showed statistically significant decreases in tetanus antibody concentrations by 19–29% at age 5 for each doubling of the PFAS exposure in early infancy.

Full text link: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/1547691X.2017.1360968

So, yes, PFAS interference with vaccine immunity is a known thing for children and adults. Try pub med or google scholar for more.

You can enjoy your popcorn as you like.

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By CopleyScott17 on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 9:20am.

... infertility might be an appropriate karmic outcome.

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By SwirlyGrrl on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 9:25am.

So maybe they lied, or maybe they had waning immunity, which is being documented worldwide. See citations, above.

The upside: if they have been vaccinated, they may not experience the severe outcomes you describe.

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By Neal on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 12:49pm.

One of my earliest memories was from late 1976 or early 1977 and being in the kitchen with six of my seven siblings when we all had chicken pox at the same time (my parents were never the "put them all together and get it over with" type, it was just unavoidable in our chaotic household). The oldest, my sister, was 11 and the youngest, my other sister, was about a year and three or four months. I was around two years and about seven or eight months old. My younger brother, who ended up being the last of us (born eight days before my third birthday), was late to the party and didn't get it with the rest of us because he hadn't been born yet. His turn came when he got it from a classmate in kindergarten. I wonder how much my immunity has waned since.

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By anon on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 7:29am.

Still got a couple scars from chicken pox I couldn’t help but itch

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By jmeltzer on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 2:21pm.

That chicken pox virus is sneaky. Even if you've had it and think you're now immune, it waits, patiently, and then comes back in a new and painful form. But there's a vaccine for shingles too.

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By MC Slim JB on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 7:22pm.

I know folks who didn’t and regretted it, as shingles is one nasty, painful mofo with lots of really harmful possible long-term complications.

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By brianjdamico on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 7:49pm.

As someone who is old enough to be in the last generation for a natural chickenpox infection before a vaccine existed for it, but is far too young to meet the age where the shingles vaccine is "recommended" for, I'll just say that having shingles sucked and I don't even think I had it that bad compared to some of the cases I've heard about since having it.

Go get vaccinated against shingles if you eligible. You will not enjoy having shingles.

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By jmeltzer on Sun, 10/06/2024 - 7:48am.

and never want to go through that again. Having to drench my back in calamine lotion for two weeks was annoying enough, and it could have been much, much worse.

Yes, those shots do hurt. They're worth it.

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By SwirlyGrrl on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 11:54pm.

I'm missing several eyelashes on one eye due to a chickenpox scar.

It isn't shingles. Hopefully I'll never get that - got my shots a couple years ago.

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By jmeltzer on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 10:49am.

Several cases in my town's high school.

Thanks, antivaxers! Let's go for diphtheria next!

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By SwirlyGrrl on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 11:00am.

Pertussis boosters or vaccinations for adults were not recommended for quite some time. There was a mistaken belief that it wasn't a big deal beyond early childhood. It wasn't in the tetanus and diptheria booster for adults for many years (TD instead of TDaP). I had to fight with my insurance to get one in 2001 when my department head (a pulmonologist!) brought it back from a medical support gig in the developing world. This situation has changed in the last 20 years now that so many adults with waning immunity have suffered from whooping cough and spread it in the community.

You may want to check your records and call your primary care physician if you don't see pertussis or TDaP in your list of vaccinations. You should get this booster every 10 years. https://www.myvaxrecords.mass.gov/pages/Public

The problem with adults and pertussis isn't entirely anti vax nonsense - it is a lack of awareness that adults need a pertussis booster. Note that state school vaccination requirements recommend - but do not require - a booster at age 11-12: https://www.mass.gov/doc/immunization-requirements-for-school-entry-1/do...

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By jmeltzer on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 2:17pm.

I just saw the doc this week. I asked, to be sure. Everyone should when they go for checkups.

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By jmeltzer on Sun, 10/06/2024 - 9:55am.

I never had mumps. None of my parents or siblings ever had mumps. This was before the vaccine existed and I have never had the vaccine either. There was a family story that we were naturally immune. (We all had everything else.)

Several doctor visits ago I decided I'd better find out if that was true, so I had the immunity test, and, guess what, I did have antibodies.

Could we all have had very mild cases and never realized it?

And should I get the shot anyway? I know those diseases are always worse in adults.

Anyone heard of anything like this? Natural immunity to "one time common" childhood diseases?

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By mg on Sun, 10/06/2024 - 3:10pm.

We know, for example, that some lucky people have asymptomatic Covid infections - lucky for them, but unlucky for those around them who can get infected by them. For another disease, there was the infamous :

... who is believed to have infected between 51 and 122 people with typhoid fever. The infections caused three confirmed deaths, with unconfirmed estimates of as many as 50. She was the first person in the United States identified as an asymptomatic carrier of the pathogenic bacteria Salmonella typhi.

So, yes, it's very possible that you had an asymptomatic case of mumps. As to getting vaccinated, the question becomes what your level of antibodies was. If it was at or above the target protection level for the vaccine, there likely wouldn't be any point, especially since your chances of being exposed to mumps is pretty low these days. That said, this is something to discuss with your doctor.

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By jmeltzer on Sun, 10/06/2024 - 4:05pm.

these days is higher than it was, say, thirty years ago.

Thanks again, antivaxers.

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By mg on Sun, 10/06/2024 - 10:37pm.

But I don't remember hearing of any mumps outbreaks in the past few years, as opposed to measles for example. If you know of any, please share info.

I grew up before most vaccines other than polio. I had rubella, mumps, measles, chicken pox, etc. My mother has never forgiven me for giving the mumps to her and everyone else in our household except my father - we had to hire someone to provide care to us all because she was too sick.

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By jmeltzer on Sun, 10/06/2024 - 11:51pm.

That was fun.

I don't hear much about that one, these days.

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By SwirlyGrrl on Sun, 10/06/2024 - 9:03pm.

When my older son got chicken pox (before the vaccine) my MIL had been watching him hours before he broke out.

She didn't remember having had them. Her mother said that she had been exposed many times and hadn't been ill - same for her brother. Her mother apparently had the same experience for her and half her siblings.

Her doctor did a titer for antibodies - she was quite immune! So was great grandma!

My husband remembered having them, but it was a mild case. Unfortunately, my then 20 month old son did not get that immunity and had a pretty standard and very itchy case. We put gloves on him.

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By lbb on Tue, 10/08/2024 - 12:57pm.

I checked my record and my last tdap was >10 years (td last year). Good to know, made a note for my next visit.

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By mg on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 1:33pm.

Besides waning immunity, no vaccine (or anything else) is 100% effective. And while rare, occasionally people can get diseases more than once (my mother still hasn't forgiven me for giving her mumps again when she was an adult).

Also, as our resident epidemiologist said, some vaccines weren't known to require boosters when they first came out. Now that people can get vaccinated outside of doctors' offices plus with people relocating, a lot of medical practices don't have good vaccination records and these students may never have gotten boosters they needed.

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By anon on Sat, 10/05/2024 - 2:06pm.

Willing to bet they are not your stereotypical image of an anti vaxxer.

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