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West Roxbury group gears up to fight off bike lanes again
By adamg on Tue, 05/11/2021 - 11:07pm
A dormant West Roxbury group that fought a proposal to add bike lanes to part of Centre Street in West Roxbury has sprung back to life, convinced that now that the pandemic is ending, City Hall and a sinister cabal of bicyclists will once again attempt to impose their will on the neighborhood.
The West Roxbury Safety Association has printed up 500 lawn signs opposing the proposal - and hopes to print up another 1,500 - to convince politicians running in the fall elections it's serious about keeping bike lanes off the neighborhood's main commercial strip, one of its leaders, Stephen Morris, told the West Roxbury Civic and Improvement Association tonight.
Morris said mayoral candidates Jon Santiago, John Barros and Annissa Essaibi-George have already pledged to block any bike lanes on Centre Street.
Although BTD has said nothing publicly about a proposed "road diet" to slow traffic on Centre Street following an angry community meeting at the Irish Social Club in November, 2019, Morris said new bike lanes along Cummins Highway and American Legion Highway in Mattapan and Roslindale show that "Downtown" still has its spoked eye on West Roxbury along with bicyclists eager to pedal all over, he said.
The city originally proposed reconfiguring Centre Street between Spring Street and the Holy Name Rotary to make it safer for pedestrians by reducing the number of motor-vehicle lanes from four to three, adding new turn lanes and pedestrian islands and installing bike lanes after Marilyn Wentworth of West Roxbury died at Centre and Hastings, thrown into the air by a motorist who said she never saw Wentworth due to solar glare on Feb. 5, 2019.
Morris, whose group said the bike lanes would actually make Centre Street more dangerous, called for the resumption of the war against the bike lanes now, warning that otherwise, "we're going to wake up one day and somebody is going to be on Centre Street putting up those white pylons." He pointed to growing social-media chatter by bicycle and pedestrian groups.
The meeting was held in person, in the parking lot of St. George's Church on Washington Street. Morris called on residents living along that thoroughfare to support his group, saying that they could be next in the city's bid to expand bike lanes.
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Comments
Fuck these NIMBY assholes. I
Fuck these NIMBY assholes. I'm not looking forward to almost getting run over every day on the way to and from the train again when my office opens back up.
Stephen Morris is a waste of
Stephen Morris is a waste of skin. Imagine how messed up in the head you have to be to think your car is more important than other people’s lives.
What's wrong with you?
With comments like
You are truly a horrible person.
As for everyone else who is criticizing the man's proposals, go on.
There will be no hyperbole
There will be no hyperbole allowed at this tea party I do
Declare
I call BS
There is nowhere in West Rox that REQUIRES you to take Centre St to arrive at one of the two stations.
Unless you're up by Crushed Stone, but that section of Centre isn't being discussed. WoooMee!
????/
If you live north of Centre Street and need to get to Highland, for example, you have to cross the street, which is very dangerous to pedestrians.
What? I live south of Centre
What? I live south of Centre Street. My train station is North of Centre Street. There isn't a magical tunnel under the street and I don't own a helicopter, so I need to walk across Centre Street to get to and from the train station. Is it really that hard to understand?
OK
And installing bike lanes ON Centre St wouldn't do anything for you commute. But WooooMeee!
The whole impetus behind this
The whole impetus behind this project is to make it safer for pedestrians, because people keep getting killed crossing the street. The road diet would condense the 4 existing lanes into 3 (one in each direction with a turning lane in the middle) and would also include the buildout of pedestrian islands. The bike lanes are essentially a byproduct of the road reconfiguration and a productive way to utilize the space that was previously taken up by the 4th lane. You dumb motherfucker.
What do bike lanes along
What do bike lanes along Centre Street have to do with crossing Centre Street?
i'll go slow
1) this road is a mess for every mode of transportation.
2) adding bike lanes will make it less of a mess, by forcing car traffic to drive slower and preventing them from having to swerve around bikes.
3) being less of a mess will make it safer for pedestrians who need to cross the street because cars and bikes won't be fighting over the same space.
Bike lanes are just one part
Bike lanes are just one part of the road diet this guy is fighting against. The plan was developed to make Centre Street safer after multiple pedestrians had been killed while crossing the street.
Bike lanes actually make pedestrians safer
A couple of quotes from actual studies to this effect:
All bike lanes? No matter how
All bike lanes? No matter how bad or good their design?
I have a tough time crossing the street with protected bike lanes that push the parking out towards the middle of the road. High-speed traffic is hidden by the parked cars.
z
Agreed...traveling by bicycle to Forest Hills from most parts of West Rox is a nightmare. Single lane roads were not designed for cars, trucks, busses, and bikes to share and are no longer feasible when the cost of sharing is lost time, real or perceived, for all parties.
It's great to ride Weld, Bussey, and South Street at night but catch me dead during traffic hours.
Agreed
I bike down Centre street regularly. I also drive down it regularly. I'm 100% in favor of the road diet. I'm also 100% in favor of these people shutting the f up. It's really strange, the neighborhood is clearly changing. Yet it still feels like all you hear are these obnoxious, ignorant, small-minded old white yahoos who still seem to think they live in Mayberry.
He would do well to fear
Studies of quiet streets initiatives during covid (and in the North End of Boston in particular) have a massive positive impact on local businesses: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-05-11/the-business-case-for...
Those quiet streets...
Do not carry three bus routes that run every 5 minutes (i.e. 15-minute headways on each route) during rush hour. They are not a fair comparison to Centre Street, which does have many local businesses, but also serves as a major commuting corridor for other destinations (Dedham Mall and the VA Hospital, among others).
Much of Elm Street in Davis
Much of Elm Street in Davis Square in Somerville has been one lane since the pandemic, and it has several bus routes that pass through regularly.
Yes, there exist one-lane
Yes, there exist one-lane roads with buses.
That doesn't imply that reducing Centre Street to one lane will have no negative effect on buses.
Buses
What do a few buses have to do with this?
If you're worried about the buses getting caught in traffic, know that
Buses matter because...
Bus riders come from the most socioeconomically disadvantaged groups -- predominately low-income folks and people of color. It's also not just "a few buses": combined, the 35/36/37 run every 5 minutes during rush hour, which equals 24 buses per hour traveling on the corridor. Last time I checked, 24 40-foot buses are not "a few".
Also, island bus stops are already present on Centre Street. It's also important to note that all-door boarding is an ongoing/planned initiative designed to provide faster rides, not to balance out the negative externalities of adding bike lanes such that riders see the same travel times.
In other words, the lack of consideration for the needs of bus riders is an issue that needs to be addressed, bike lanes or not.
The road diet and complicated
The road diet and complicated traffic light phases to separate right turns from protected bike lanes on Mass Ave through MIT made things MUCH, MUCH worse for buses. Even in the direction that got a bus lane.
I don't see how you can declare that a road reconfiguration won't make things worse for buses. What if it does?
LOL 5 minutes. More like you
LOL 5 minutes. More like you get all three of them at once and it's a half hour until the next one comes. Because they all get caught up in the same car traffic of people double parking in the right lane and turning in the left.
Actual road design would increase the transit efficiency a LOT in addition to making everything safer. Or, if busses are soooo bad, the neighborhood could push for the OLX. But that'll never happen, because Westie in 2021 is just as provincial, small minded and racist as Arlington was when they defeated the Red Line and shot themselves in the foot.
Nice try anon
But the city already did the traffic study that showed the safety changes would have a negligible impact on travel times.
I commute on Centre Street daily (on foot, by bike, and by bus) and can confirm that without the study. The road is mostly empty between lights except for the bursts of motorists drag racing each other to the next traffic light.
It's also consistently dangerous. I've been hit from behind at Walgreens when a car in front of me stopped and I've nearly been hit multiple times by speeding vehicles in multiple crosswalks around Centre and Corey Streets.
Having dangerous streets does nothing to support local business. Even if it did, that's no excuse for putting the neighborhood's residents at risk.
Still to the Weld St / Vermont St alternative
You can drive 40mph+ without nearly as many crosswalks and lights!
[This is sarcasm.]
Washington street in
Washington street in roslindale has 9 bus lines. And they somehow managed to accommodate bike lanes.
The microchips aren’t working
We’re supposed to have our Agenda 21 one-world government, bike lanes and taco trucks by now. I guess that lab leak was for naught.
Foiled again by those intrepid retirees.
Oh well, I’ll do pickup at Chilacates instead.
I don't get the opposition.
I don't get the opposition. Is it just a smooth-brained need to be in opposition to things regardless of whether or not it has any meaningful impact on them? Couldn't these hicks put this effort into literally anything else?
Granted that pic of dude with a "I have a collection of pictures of the local highschoool swim team"-style bowl-cut is pretty great.
smooth-brained
That's awesome. I'm going to borrow that.
.
.
Good
Good
This is so stupid
Centre St. in West Roxbury is one of the most annoying roads in the area, whether you’re a driver, a pedestrian, a bus rider, or a bicyclist. The 4 lane design leads to constant weaving around turning cars and double parkers. The unsafe curb build-outs at intersections mean the buses stop in traffic lanes, which leads to more weaving. There’s no room for bikes except to travel in the middle of a traffic lane, which is the legal and safest practice under the circumstances. A 3 lane road is the solution, with bike lanes on the side and a dedicated left-turn lane in the middle.
And where do buses go?
With a 3-lane road, buses will still stop in the middle of a traffic lane, except the weaving will be more dangerous. To drive around a stopped bus, cars will have to go into the turn lane and potentially face oncoming traffic. This is dangerous for both bus riders and pedestrians, since almost all the bus stops are located at intersections.
No one so far has proposed a design that would improve bus service on the corridor -- in fact, the city's initial proposal even called for the elimination of several bus stops. Since buses will be stuck in general traffic under any road diet, and since congestion will undoubtedly increase, the end result will be lengthened commutes and less reliable transit for those who cannot afford the 3x premium charged by the Commuter Rail ($1.70 bus or $2.40 bus + subway, versus $6.50 for CR alone). Who is representing the voices of the thousands of daily bus riders on Centre Street, a group that includes the VA's behind-the-scenes staff, nursing home staff, trailer-park residents, grocery store and restaurant workers, and people with disabilities?
Yes, the road is dangerous, but the lack of consideration for some of the most vulnerable users of the corridor -- bus riders -- is concerning and needs to be addressed. A redesign that does not incorporate robust public transit improvements would just be a less explicit form of hostile infrastructure.
Bus stops would be separated from the travel lane
The plan would be for bus stops to be between the car travel lane and the bike lane. You can see an illustration of that in the original Northeastern study: http://www.northeastern.edu/peter.furth/road-diet-for-centre-street-west...
As for delaying bus riders, who I very much agree deserve a high priority, the engineering study found that proposed corridor changes would lengthen trip by at most 2 minutes, during a short by higher congestion time window.
In essence, buses would pull to the side at bus stops, and would mostly take about the same time they require now to transit the area. In return, pedestrian and bike safety (many of whom are also bus riders) would be enhanced.
A 2 minute increase in bus
A 2 minute increase in bus travel times is huge. It's most likely an average, so on a given day your bus could be much more delayed.
Once they start talking about a 2 minute decrease in bus times, I'll think about supporting the project.
That's easy
The buses stop where the curb build-outs used to be. That leaves plenty of room for the bike lane, the travel lane, and the turning lane, all to the left of the stopped bus.
Bike lanes
All you have to do is spend a day walking in the Back Bay Beacon street , Comm ave and down by north station which all have bike lanes
NO ONE is using them I work down there all day long ..might see at tops 10-20 bicyclists all day
Stop trying to destroy Main Street business around our city who absolutely need the help. You don’t need bicycle lanes to slow down traffic on Center street.
Funny thing
Since bikes in bike lanes are more efficient for local travel and take up less space, they appear less used than a street with the same amount of cars.
That logic doesn't make sense
That logic doesn't make sense. At any spot on Comm Ave (or any major street in the city) the flux of the number of bikes passing by is lower than the number of cars passing by.
It's not bicycles taking up less space than cars do, but that there are fewer of them.
it makes perfect sense
have you ever seen a traffic jam on the minuteman bike path?
Beacon St. Somerville in the Beforetimes
Commuting home I would bunch up at a light with 25-30 cyclists.
We would all clear the intersection in less time than it took five cars going the other direction.
That's why the traffic studies found that a substantial percentage of the traffic during rush hour was cyclists - like a third to a half. We didn't jam up because we take up much less space.
DOT hired my boy to work on tech counting cars, bikes, pedestrians, etc. in support of the humanizing of city streets and other improvements for safety. The numbers are happening.
I've worked in BB for 20
I've worked in BB for 20 years and I see biking commuters all.day.long.
The argument that Main Streets will be destroyed is such an old and tired song. Also, completely untrue.
Main Streets are being destroyed by cars and the ppl that drive them. I no longer do my errands on Centre b/c I am tired of almost getting hit or playing Frogger w/ cars in the crosswalks. Every single time I walk down Centre. This is the reality of foot and bike commuters. Yes, walkers & bikers are commuters too - car owners (and I am one) do not own the streets.
Meanwhile
In Davis Square Somerville there have for years been these bike corrals that hold about 30 bikes per parking space.
They make it attractive for cyclists to go there and buy things.
Cyclists are more likely than motorists to visit local businesses and spend $$$ - in other words, to save main street.
Anecdotal evidence is not a strong argument
People who analyze these things need to conduct actual counts. And it turns out that such counts happen in Boston. On Charles St., for example, bikes represented 1 of 3 vehicles during morning rush hour in 2019. That was without any bike lanes at all. A similar count today, would likely yield an even higher percentage.
https://mass.streetsblog.org/2020/09/04/boston-bike-counts-make-the-case...
yeah I was gonna say
Yeah I was gonna say there's numbers out here to support the fact that biking has INCREASED in our region after adding more bike lanes.
I'm no biker lover, but the numbers speak for itself. "If you build it, they will come" is true here.
And frankly as someone who tried to bike 20 years ago here and sold it after being door'd too many times, I welcome these lanes and it does make biking more attractive because its safer.
So they cherry picked one
So they cherry picked one hour on one road. A road which only had 348 cars per hour -- hardly a major traffic artery.
I support bikes. I don't support dishonest statistics.
citations please
citations please
this is hilarious
do you actually sit at the window where you work and count cyclists?
what does your workplace think of your productivity?
... so you don't actually have an accurate count of cyclists, do you?
just an already established dislike of them.
Your comment is divorced from reality
Unless you're counting 4 AM traffic during the height of lockdown, in which case that *might* be plausible.
There are a ton of cyclists on those roads. I know because I used to commute along those (except for North Station) and I was frequently passing or getting passed by other cyclists.
Bus/Bike Lane
Somerville recently turned the right lanes on most four lane streets into bus/bike only lanes, keeping them a full lane width.
As a driver I was worried what this would do to traffic but it’s actually been an improvement. No more weaving in and out as you said and I imagine it would make biking a lot more pleasant. Traffic flow really hasn’t been impacted.
In Westie this would make being a pedestrian a lot nicer to, no more having to worry that someone’s going angrily weave around the traffic stopped at the crosswalk for you.
There are no bus lanes
Being proposed here. If anything, the city has actually proposed the elimination of several bus stops along the corridor, which hurts the vulnerable populations who tend to ride buses.
Actually it's 6 lanes of cars
Actually it's 6 lanes of cars in a Main Street district. 6 lanes. Whether you're a pedestrian or biker you take your life into your hands every time you try and cross Centre street. In crosswalks or not. And for those that will poo-poo this - get out of your cars and walk West Roxbury everyday at all different times and let us know how you fare.
These goons are worried that people from "downtown" want to bike all over the city that they pay taxes in? How dare they! Sounds like the good old WRox dog whistle to me.
Take a right turn across any
Take a right turn across any bike lane in Cambridge or Boston, it's heartstopping. There has to be a better way.
Many ways to handle this
The bike lane and travel lane can have separate signals.
Drivers can learn to turn their heads to check blind spots before making all turns. Road tests can require this skill be mastered, as happens in civilized countries.
Hitting cyclists or pedestrians can be harshly punished as it is in civilized countries.
Car ownership and use can reflect actual costs rather than being heavily subsidized, as it is...you know.
Very helpful
Now I know who not to vote for.
Exactly
My thoughts on who not to vote for and even help campaign against. Long live the bicycle Cabral!
Yep!
I also know that Mayor Janey is for sure car-free, and Councilor Wu is either car-free or car light. Both use the T regularly and Councilor Wu commutes on bike regularly, including with kids.
As a parent in a walking/biking family, I particularly want to hear from people whose kids walk and bike or who are familiar with families who do, because infrastructure really needs to be done correctly for kids and families to use it. Like, the city's default response on bike lanes constantly being blocked is that it's fine for people to use them as parking lots, because fit young adults on road bikes can easily just merge into car traffic to bypass it. However, this means there are routes on which it would otherwise be safe to send kids (or smaller/less-fit adults with a trailer or a loaded bike, or elders, or people with disabilities...) but isn't currently since there might be vacant city vehicle or USPS/UPS truck sitting in a bike lane.
I think that it's better to
I think that it's better to think how we can make it safe for everyone...people without families and who are able-bodied would like to be considered.
And there you have it
The "all lives matter in traffic" guy has arrived.
Essaibi-George
In 2019 Essaibi-George met with me and a group of pedestrian safety advocates at Local 338. She agreed redesigning Centre Street was the right decision and talked with us about convincing skeptical business owners.
She also seemed to think “moot” and “mute” were the same word, which at one point kind of confused the discussion. That was the most memorable part of speaking with her.
She's a patsy for cops and developers
No thanks!
Body language
Is always quite telling.
Looks like a fun dad or uncle.
another tell
the reframing of “safety” to mean *opposing* measures to make the road safer. these guys love doing that
When is "Reframing" just lying?
This road wasn't built for 4 lanes. It is wide because of the street car that used to be there.
yes
this is the the essence of the question i ask myself about reactionaries; are they just straight up lying when they do shit like this? what am *i* lying about to satisfy my own fucked up desires?
Pedestrian islands
Setting aside the plan to reconfigure the lanes, the pedestrian island idea seems like a no-brainer, especially at the Centre & Hastings intersection. I cross there all the time (usually pushing a stroller) and it always feels dicey.
Let the mayor know
This link is from city website to contact Mayor Janey. Takes two minutes. Important to let her know many people in West Roxbury want safety improvements. https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc7vdhGO7CBDkIwk0ThujJe8i6jeGV7...
Or go here and scroll https://www.boston.gov/departments/mayors-office/kim-janey
Trumpers
People reading this need to understand this is all a culture war play. Mr. Morris and his anti-bike lane cohort took over the Ward 20 Republican Committee last year because it wasn't sufficiently pro-Trump for their liking. They are the "Blue Lives Matter" crowd that hates bike lanes because they associate them with liberals. That's what this is, nothing more. Any mayoral candidate who associates with this and supports them is not fit to serve in the office.
Yes, but ...
The other Republican slate was also against the bike lanes.
Cancel Culture?
The Ward 20 Republican Committee uses cancel culture to stop what is seen as a way to make Centre Street in West Roxbury safer.
This is sadly a thing
I previously commuted by bike all over the eastern/central part of the state.
People in the more heavily Republican communities and/or with such stickers on their vehicles like to rev their engines when passing me and/or scream slurs out the window.
Shouldn't they appreciate biking, since they claim to like hard work and ruggedness or whatever?
The 2021 GOP stands for three things:
"We love how Benito Cheeto gives us permission to air our bigotries against anyone that ain't exactly like us" (white, Christian, straight, sub-literate); "Own the libs" (even when it's economically or otherwise self-sabotaging); and, um... nothing else. Two things.
A slight problem with your reporting
St. George's Church is on Emmonsdale Rd. St. John Chrysostom is on Washington Street.
They may be wrong, but their efforts, to say the least, will mean there will be community input. BTD doesn't always do that, and that does include bike lanes.
...hasn't there already been a ton of community input here?
Adam's story links to two different community discussions about this. How much more community input is needed here?
BTD held one meeting - favored by wide margin
In June 2019 BTD held a meeting to review the proposal for a 4:3 lane conversion. When public comment opened up, over 30 people spoke in favor of the proposal and 5 spoke against.
One of those against was perennially losing candidate, Marty Keough. Marty childishly took hold of the microphone before the meeting hosts asked speakers to queue up. He then tried to railroad the meeting by claiming to speak for the assembled group of over 200 people, saying “everyone here is against this”.
For the next hour a steady stream of people went to the mic and calmly, rationally, stated support, citing personal anecdotes and statements by experts.
Well, yes, they officially held one meeting
But they announced they were putting the whole thing on hold at the second meeting, at the Irish Social Club. True, they didn't call that one, but they were there. And true, people were being questioned at the door if they supported bike lanes and were, at best, given angry stares if they stupidly said yes, and, sure, the one or two people who stood up to support them were booed, as was Matt O'Malley, who was accused of being a socialist once he got past Forest Hills, and people angrily yelled about "our roads" and stuff, but it's not like BTD wasn't there.
Correct on all points
To your point, BTD representatives and some electeds were kind to attend, and doing their job to listen. As you noted it was in no way a city of Boston forum to gauge community sentiment. Just a whine-fest produced by and for these people. A few of my neighbors went, just to take it in. But there was no reason for people favoring the BTD plan to show up in numbers.
About Steve Morris...
I copied and pasted below the (long) comment I posted the last time I saw the name "Steve Morris" appear on this column. It's never a good omen and unfortunately it is still relevant; slumlord Steve Morris is still fully dedicated to make our streets as unsafe as he can all over the City -not just in West Roxbury.
Related story:
https://www.universalhub.com/2019/citizen-complaint-day-when-does-police...
Holly cow, as I was casually reading this comment, I felt like the name Steve Morris of West Roxbury sounded familiar, and it just flashed in my little brain!
I am 99% sure that it's the same Steve Morris who owns of one of the worst, if not THE worst problem properties in Fields Corner (Dorchester). For that troubled part of the neighborhood, this is no small feat. That’s the kind of property that every cop in the district knows because that’s where people regularly get arrested on drug and gun charges, the trash is often spilling all over the place, snow doesn’t get shoveled etc. I actually walked past it this evening and unsurprisingly it was the one property on that street where the trash barrels were left on the sidewalk three days after pick up. On warm days, that's the kind of gang-banger hangout that make people cross the street to walk on the other side. The heavy steel bars at the windows are also a nice touch.
According to a longtime neighbor, he is a trust fund baby who inherited that property from a relative a while ago and quickly managed to turn it into the scourge of the neighborhood.
Its (very partial) record is easily searchable by entering the 73 Charles St address in this page's search box:
https://data.boston.gov/dataset/public-works-violations/resource/90ed381...
Story connected to that address that made it to the news (the police is there often, but the outcome rarely gets published).
https://www3.bostonglobe.com/metro/2018/01/20/dorchester-men-arrested-gu...
You’ve got to admire this dude’s dedication in making our streets unsafe all over the City in any way that he can. I'd suggest creating an award after him; "The Steve Morris Unsafe Street Award".
Do they hate money? Their neighbors?
Let's say there's a group of people clamoring for bike lanes in your area. You're not a cyclist, so you're instantly opposed.
But do you ever step back and wonder who these people are clamoring for the lanes in the first place?
They're not trans-continental cycling nomads looking to get from Bangor to Atlanta by way of West Roxbury. They're either your neighbors looking to get to around in a way that doesn't fill your streets with cars or they're other people in the area looking to come to West Roxbury to shop, eat, play, and generally spend money at your local businesses.
None of the reasons someone would find to put a bike lane in your area are bad. If you are foreseeing yourself sitting in traffic next to a semi-empty bike lane "that you could have been driving in to avoid this traffic", then you're part of the problem.
ummm excuse you, this is west
ummm excuse you, this is west roxbury. if those so-called "neighbors" aren't living in homes their grandparents bought when they moved here to get away from bussing, they're actually just TRANSPLANTS and OUTSIDERS and don't understand or appreciate the wonderful lifestyle and culture of west roxbury :) also this neighborhood doesn't want COMMUNIST LEFTIST money from BICYCLING MILLENIAL SNOWFLAKES ok. go back to JP and eat avocado toast, L-O-L
Given that they tried to get
Given that they tried to get people fired from their jobs from supporting the road diet in 2019, they definitely, definitely hate their neighbors.
They also seem to think anyone wanting to travel into West Roxbury on a bike is an anarcho-communist coming to pillage Centre St.'s banks and pizza places.
The only remaining question...
Why would anyone want to live in such a parochial, crabby, againsty, cranky neighborhood?
I would not want to. It is
I would not want to. It is easier to get downtown from Quincy or JP than West Rox.
This is unfortunately true
And it's another reason why the exclusion of bus riders from this road-diet conversation is problematic, bike lanes or not.
Green space, quiet
Green space, quiet neighborhoods, availability of single family homes, and the knowledge that time will silence these people eventually.
Well
I found a lovely home for a decent (for Boston) price there a decade ago, and unfortunately the realtor didn't inform me that a portion of the neighborhood were lunatics. Weird.
Also there's the fact that "parochial, crabby, againsty, and cranky" describes literally every neighborhood in the entire state of Massachusetts.
The real answer:
A lot of these discussions make a lot more sense when you finally realize: they just don't care about anyone but themselves.
What amazes me
What's really amazing to me is how simple-minded and/or short-sighted you have to be to think fighting the bike lanes benefits themselves.
Sure, there's the much more intangible benefits of fewer cars means better air quality and less noise pollution. I could see how people might not truly appreciate those benefits because "well, I lived an extra 2-3 years of my life because there were fewer cars on my road due to all the people using bikes or taking different routes around my area" isn't something someone foresees saying on their deathbed.
But turning an entire lane into a bike/bus lane in Allston should be a great example of immediate benefit to drivers as well as everyone else. I don't get stuck in traffic there as often any more. There are many fewer double parkers in front of all the restaurants. Those that there are don't linger as long as when they were blocking a travel lane (because you stick out like a sore thumb now for BTD and/or BPD to deal with you). Through traffic isn't expecting to have two lanes to use, so people aren't stuck behind turning vehicles or bikes or buses. And the days when I'm using my bike to commute downtown or pick up food at one of the restaurants, I don't get stuck in traffic at all!
Again, not a good comparison
There are no bus lanes being proposed here. In fact, the narrowing of the street would prevent bus lanes from being built in the future without tearing up everything again.
It's difficult to see any benefit to bus riders in this proposal.
Christ, what an asshole
Translation: We car drivers don't watch where we're going.
This is a common sentiment
I've had many legitimately kind and accepting folks tell me how worried they are about hitting cyclists and how you can't see them on right turns and when opening your door.
Yes, you very much can if you do these two things correctly. (Turn your head to check over your shoulder on all turns and lane changes, and open your car doors using the Dutch reach.) It's just so accepted in American car culture that you drive however and wherever tf you want.
Turning your head doesn't do
Turning your head doesn't do much if sight lines to the bike lane are protected by a row of parked cars.
Centre St.
Centre Street’s “shopping/ retail” life or desperate lack there of is a depressing disgrace.
It’s a pain in the neck to drive & it’s not any better to walk. Change is coming. Like it or not. Thank God.
Centre Street Business
I used to live walking distance to Centre St and we used to love walking down to get haircuts, or grab something to eat, or do any number of errands. We now have moved to the suburbs and still like to come back and support those businesses that sponsored our kids' little league teams, and school fundraisers. If the businesses feel that the bike lanes will hurt their ability to stay in business or be successful, then I support them in their fight against the bike lanes.
I do agree that if it makes parking more difficult or there is more traffic, then I'm less likely to go out of my way to frequent those places.
If the businesses feel that
If the businesses feel that the bike lanes will hurt their ability to stay in business or be successful, then they're misinformed and should listen to the civil engineers who did the traffic study and actually know what they're talking about with this stuff. It's not going to make parking more difficult. IIRC, the proposed road diet only called for the elimination of 12 parking spots along the entire stretch from Spring Street to the rotary. That's a mile long stretch and there is never a shortage of open spots in the current configuration.
"more traffic"
What causes traffic are automobiles, not bikes. If you drive a car and complain about "traffic", you are literally part of the problem you're complaining about.
Bike lanes and pedestrian infrastructure do not "cause traffic", but cars do. In fact they make it that much easier for residents to do exactly what you say, have a walk to Centre street to visit a restaurant or make a quick bike stop to pick something up at a local shop.
What you seem to be saying is that your need to drive from the burbs is more important than the ability of actual west rox residents to easily access local businesses by foot or bike.
Businesses aren't surviving
Businesses aren't surviving on the patronage of people walking or riding their bikes, plus there already is a walking lane its called the sidewalk. What I am saying is I don't need to drive to West Roxbury for haircuts and meals, but I like to to support the businesses. If that becomes more difficult to do so, my desire to do that will decrease, thus, hurting the businesses. I don't think its necessary to spend money to accommodate the 25 people who would like to ride their bikes.
And what you are saying is that because you moved to West Roxbury, you should be able to change it because you think your views are more important than those folks who have been tied to the community for decades.
And what you are saying is
What you're saying is that you think your views are more important than the people who actually live here (unlike yourself). Go kick rocks.
How big do you feel your impact is?
Obviously they're not, if the infrastructure is hostile and dangerous to both cyclists and pedestrians. But could they be?
Already addressed under "needing to cross the street".
That's nice, but tell me this: just how much clout do you think your economic contribution to the neighborhood merits? Are you, and other sentimental suburbanites like you, what makes the difference for these businesses?
Assuming your lowball number of 25 is correct, that's still 24 more than you.
...but who have left for the suburbs. Their views should count double, right?
And there it is...
This is what it always comes down to in these discussions. Change averse xenophobia.
I'd bet $1000
That 'Nona' has a blue lives matter flag flying on their suburban home.
I like to support the businesses as well
I hate driving on Centre St as it is a cluster**** of as*hole drivers speeding and swerving around cars trying to make a left hand turn. 6 Lanes of Centre St are dedicated to cars (two for parking,4 for driving). That is excessive.I take my life into my hands every time I cross the street at the Holy Name Rotary and then across Centre St by the 7-11. I have had to jump out of the way of cars speeding off the rotary on to Centre St and blast through the cross walk on numerous occasions, once as a fine upstanding BPD officer watched and when I confronted him said "you made it across, you're all set". I for one will not be supporting any Mayoral candidate who comes out against this.
And what you are saying is
BINGO! I just got a bingo here.
Centre street sucks to get to, in either cars or bikes. I live right off centre and I'd rather drive down to Dedham to run errands than fight car traffic on Centre or take my life in my hands walking. Slowing the road and making it possible to bike/walk, or park at one end and walk around the area, would make it less hostile to people WHO ACTUALLY LIVE HERE. But hell, somebody's trying to build apartments to hand those businesses dozens more customers at their door and old school westie curmudgeons don't like that, either.
The good news is the way it's going, all those businesses are closing anyway, so soon there won't be any use for the street except speeding on through on your way back to your suburban paradise.
At 11 am, when my bus is the
At 11 am, when my bus is the only vehicle on the road, and it takes significantly longer than it used to along a certain stretch due to the traffic light phases for bikes that no bikes make use of, I think it's safe to say the bike infrastructure is causing the delay rather than me.
That's a cop out. Why do a
That's a cop out. Why do a handful of businesses (whom I no longer give my $ to) get to decide what happens with public parking spaces? Also interesting that most were very quiet about being against the road diet. It says a lot that they felt losing 16 tax-payer owned parking spaces would hurt their businesses - their business must not be so great.
Why is socialism ok for these people? Here is an idea...let those businesses buy the 16 parking spaces at market rate and then use that $ for the road diet.
westroxburysafetyassociation.com
Has anyone seen westroxburysafetyassociation.com
Pretty clever use of national roadway death data against this so-called "safety committee".
Never change WR!
There are times I miss living in WR… this would not be one of those times…
Boston politics are so broken
Boston politics are so broken when a few noisy nonsensical crackpots manage to gum up roadway safety improvements where there is clear evidence of danger with the current configuration and clear proven techniques for making the roadway safer. I'm so tired of having continually express my support over and over again for sensible solutions because of a bunch of loudmouths who are simply opposed to anything changing.
Bike lanes
are for outdoor dining seating.