Boy a country with only 9+ Million whose populated area could fit into roughly the 495-belt sure can throw its weight on academia and government here.

How about letting the protesters do their thing since it will dissipate by next week anyway and fix the T instead?

Fascism? Hardly

By Ron Newman on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:18am.

The students were given multiple warnings, and by the time the arrests occurred, only 10 remained in the camp. From the reports I've read, they were arrested peacefully and without resistance.

The protest, along with the responses to it from other people and groups not affiliated with MIT, was starting to interfere with MIT's normal day-to-day functioning. There was a non-zero possibility that the events at UCLA would repeat here. It needed to end, at least in this form.

(Disclaimer: I'm an MIT alum, class of 1979)

If They Weren't Anti Israel Genocide Protesters....

By John Costello on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:24am.

Would you have also supported their removal?

Dissent is being quashed in this state and elsewhere in the country at the behest of the wealthy and from foreign powers, but somehow you are ok with it, or so it appears.

(Human Being With A Compassionate Soul - Class of 91).

I don't see this as quashing dissent

By BostonDog on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:39am.

And I agree with Ron's comments regarding the protesters.

Hamas has explicitly said they want genocide of Jews and the formation of a single, conservative religious state they alone control.

Meanwhile, the Israeli government actions have been immoral and extremely counter productive to the safety and security for the people of Israel.

I guess you misseed that whole part about why it was shut down

By HenryAlan 2.0 on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 1:10pm.

Ron covered it:

The protest, along with the responses to it from other people and groups not affiliated with MIT, was starting to interfere with MIT's normal day-to-day functioning.

There was plenty of speech freely given and openly allowed, but at the end of the day, the encampments are on private property (or city property in the case of Emerson), and other people also have rights. The protests long ago transitioned from making a point about Gaza to being a point unto themselves. I agree with you that it's unfortunate it ended this way, but the remaining stalwarts had their say, and don't have exclusive rights to the campus.

Yes, Fascism

By SwirlyGrrl on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 1:40pm.

Kornbluth's "justification" was pure "precrime has been committed".

Read her statement. Astoundingly mealymouthed cover for fascism. (MIT '88)

Amazing the cops could find the time

By Michael on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 9:16am.

In between completely ignoring traffic violations and sitting around construction sites looking at their phones.

I guess "here's a chance to overpower some hippies" is a better workday than "here's a chance to solve some crimes or help some people"

Harvard will be next

By necturus on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 9:36am.

Both sides are acting poorly.

The students have to know that their actions will have no consequences whatsoever for Gazans. Even were Harvard to sell its shares, the companies in question would continue to support Israel, albeit with the buyer's money and not Harvard's.

Harvard's academic year is essentially over. The freshmen living in the yard will be moving out. At that point, Harvard should seal off the Yard and allow no one to enter. Protestors will need to go out to get food and other supplies, and Harvard should not let them back in. In a week's time the Yard will be empty.

Wow Starve Them Out - That's What You Want To Do?

By John Costello on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 9:40am.

Are you with the IDF now or did you come forward in time from the British Government circa 1845?

Both sides are wretched

By BostonDog on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 10:08am.

And there's not a fitting analogy to prior conflicts. (Except maybe the hundred years war.) Calling for peace is meaningless when the leaders on both sides are not interested in ending the war until impossible demands are met.

I feel sad for the civilians on both sides. Their leadership is unconcerned about their welfare.

It's better than sending in cops

By necturus on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:44am.

They'll stay until they run out of what they need. Then they'll leave. Nobody will starve, unlike in Gaza. And nobody will suffer violence, again unlike in Gaza.

The students have to know that their actions will have no conseq

By HPboy on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 10:06am.

Disagree. Would Biden have taken any action (as late in the day and as minimal as it is) to reign in Bibi without the student protests?

Yes

By BostonDog on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 10:16am.

I think so. I think Biden is horrified by Netanyahu's actions but doesn't want to see the elimination of Israel -- Hamas's longstanding goal.

I think Biden has been a pretty good president, all told. He understands the conflict better than most of the protesters.

Biden is horrified by Netanyahu's actions

By HPboy on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:36am.

There were already tens of thousands of civilians slaughtered before Biden raised a finger. Biden is horrified by his polling numbers.

You think his public statement is all there was?

By HenryAlan 2.0 on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 1:13pm.

Don't be naive. Back channel diplomacy has been constant throughout this conflict.

Did I miss a headline or something?

By necturus on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:55am.

When last I checked, "Bibi" wasn't anything like "reined in". Bombs are falling, people are starving, and the body counts continue to rise.

Here's the bottom line: student protests never accomplish anything. They didn't get Lyndon Johnson to stop the Vietnam war; they didn't get Harvard out of South Africa; they didn't make anyone sell their Exxon Mobil shares.

Remember Occupy Wall Street? That was a great success, wasn't it?

Students should understand that their value as protestors is essentially zero. They aren't victims; they are perceived by the larger world as spoiled rich kids. They're not oppressed workers or downtrodden minorities, but members of an elite who owe their own privileged status in part to the very injustices they protest against.

They'd do better to stick to their studies. If, later in life, they're still passionate about the causes they now champion, they'll have the money and influence to actually make a difference.

Huh

By Pete X on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 12:27pm.

You keep saying protests don't do anything, but I'm afraid that's not backed up by the facts.

You sure that sanctions and international pressure which student protests helped call for didn't have anything at all to do with the fall of apartheid? The South African regime just magically collapsed?

Here's one government source that disagrees with you: https://geneva.usmission.gov/2013/12/17/pressure-to-end-apartheid-began-...

Fact is, people who are against what people are protesting never like the protests. I think that's what's happening here.

Not so

By necturus on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 12:49pm.

I'm very much in sympathy with the Palestinian cause. But the protests won't help it. This feels like 1968 all over again; even the calendar is the same.

And in 1968, all those campus protests did was help elect Richard Nixon. The war went on for seven more years.

What do you suppose Donald Trump will do for Palestine once he's back in the White House?

Realpolitik

By Pete X on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 1:24pm.

So if you're in sympathy with the Palestinians, instead of bitching about the uselessness of the protesters you could be urging Biden to use his influence to stop the genocide?

Which is what the protestors want too...

You can't win by telling Americans passionately against unjust US government supported violence in places like Vietnam or Gaza to pipe down until after the election, and sending in the cops only draws further attention. its possible Biden has already lost Michigan because of the Gaza destruction.

Probably quicker than that

By Ari O on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 10:26am.

Press statements are that ten people were arrested. Which means that maybe 1 in 3 tents were actually occupied overnight. I doubt there's a stockpile of food, water and rations there. Plus there are things that aren't provided in tents, like, you know, bathroom facilities. Go clear it out on a night when it's pouring rain and the crowd may be even sparser.

Harvard is a bit trickier because they are having commencement in the Yard so they can't just close it down (I wouldn't be surprised if the MIT protest springs back up in Killian, to fuck with commencement).

Yesterday the protests moved over to block the exit of the Stata garage which I'm sure made a bunch of people sympathetic to their demands.

for background

By deedle on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:21am.

If you have any interest in understanding the perspective and rationale of MIT protest organizers, I suggest you read Richard Solomon's op-ed in The Tech from March 7th: https://thetech.com/2024/03/07/river-to-sea-to-every-mountain-top (~5K words).

BOTH SIDES

By SwirlyGrrl on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 1:41pm.

BOTH SIDES BOTH SIDES BOTH SIDES

Good

By Sock_Puppet on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 9:46am.

It was about time.

https://orgchart.mit.edu/letters/actions-encampment

...as president, my responsibility is to the whole community: to make sure that the campus is physically safe and functioning for everyone, that our shared spaces and resources are available for everyone, and that everyone feels free to express their views and do the work they came here to do. As you will see, in numerous ways, the presence of the encampment increasingly made it impossible to meet all these obligations.

A very small minority of the student body was involved with this encampment, making the campus unsafe and unwelcoming for the rest. At the end only ten people decided to stay and be arrested. They got their time, and their time was up.

The escalation of the last few days, involving outside threats from individuals and groups from both sides, has been a tipping point. It was not heading in a direction anyone could call peaceful. And the cost and disruption for the community overall made the situation increasingly untenable. We did not believe we could responsibly allow the encampment to persist.

The actions we've taken, gradually stepped up over time, have been commensurate with the risk we are in a position to see. We did not take this step suddenly. We offered warnings. We telegraphed clearly what was coming. At each point, the students made their own choices. And finally, choosing among several bad options, we chose the path we followed this morning – where each student again had a choice.

"unsafe and unwelcoming"

By deedle on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:17am.

https://mstdn.ca/@dbattistella/112407733248647600

"Israeli nationalists love to pretend to be scared of us to mainstream media and to #MIT admin, then casually stroll into our encampment and pull this crap." - #MITJewsForCeasefire

Former Israeli naval officer who fought in Gaza, told Fox News he was "truly afraid" to walk on campus due to anti-Israel protests, claiming "I'm terrified"

The camp itself didn't make anyone unsafe. But ...

By Ron Newman on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:28am.

MIT's outdoor campus, unlike part of Harvard's, is entirely unfenced and open to the world. I have confidence that MIT students and faculty with different opinions can work things out or at least avoid violence. But outside agitators are a real thing, and they were showing up on both sides. We've seen how that played out at UCLA, and I have no desire to see a similar situation develop here.

Outside Agitators?

By John Costello on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:36am.

You sound like Norman Fell talking to Dustin Hoffman in The Graduate or a Newsmax host.

What would you call this person?

By Ron Newman on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:41am.

Photo I took on Tuesday

Certainly not an MIT student, faculty member, or other employee. The protest camp was becoming a magnet for such people.

A large pro-Israel rally on Friday, on the steps of 77 Mass. Ave., was also instigated by an outside organization unconnected with MIT.

You Are Old Enough To Remember

By John Costello on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 11:45am.

The Osmonds had a song when you were hitting puberty which went "One Bad Apple Don't Spoil The Whole Bunch Girl".

One lunatic does not discredit the anti-genocidal intent of hundreds of others.

You are sounding like a Newsmax host or worse an RKO radio host.

So what?

By SwirlyGrrl on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 1:43pm.

You are probably old enough to remember when people would argue that "having women at MIT will distract the male students"

Stop blaming the protestors for the actions of others.

Not all protestors

By Ari O on Fri, 05/10/2024 - 2:05pm.

And I don't speak Arabic or know if these subtitles are correct, but if so … not great. Might also not be MIT students, who can say. If you go to a rally, probably best not to repeat things in a language you don't understand. (And I could be wrong here, they could be chanting for a two-state solution!)

Big Sally is Watching You!

Riot cops descend on MIT encampment

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Fascism In America